三泰虎

为什么印度新娘要向未来的丈夫奉上嫁妆

Why do Indian brides have to pay dowry to prospective husbands?

为什么印度新娘必须向未来的丈夫奉上嫁妆?

 印度新娘

QUORA网站读者评论:

Raja Garlapati

India is as ancient as human exstence. India have many terms and terminologies that may be alien to others, but it doesn’t mean it doesn’t exst.

Dowry: Bride side typically pays the groom side. Short term disadvantage to bride, they have to pay the groom. It has some advantages too, overnight after marriage, the woman who married the man is having legal rights of the property of the groom and his parental property. Remember India is a nation that has good amount of parental property. No doubt arranged marriages are done to check the groom and his parental property or grand parental property. Property plays an important role in arranged marriages. After marriage it is duty bound to feed the wife and take care of her. These sort of marriages are typical in higher castes. The woman is not expected to work outside after marriage, however becomes almost like the property manager managing the property, can be called as queen of the house etc, etc. Woman is expected to be in the house of the man life long.

印度就和人类存在的历史一样古老。印度有许多国家可能并不常见的规定和说法,但这并不意味着它就不存在。

嫁妆:女方给男方的。短期看对印度新娘是个损失,因为女方要给新郎钱。但也有好处,婚后一夜,嫁给这个男人的女人就合法地拥有了新郎和他父母的财产。记住,印度是一个父母财产很多的国家。包办婚姻无疑是为了核实新郎及其父母或其祖父母的财产。财产在包办婚姻中起着重要的作用。婚后赡养和照顾妻子是义不容辞的责任。这种婚姻在高种姓中很典型。人们不希望女方婚后在外工作,女方会变成像物业经理那样打理物业,可以被称为房子的女王等等。女人应该在男人的房子里生活一辈子的。

Bride price: Bride side is paid to get the woman married, typically to her father. Now the girl is expected to work outside, earn and provide the earning to the groom family. This is typical lower castes. Labourers who you see both spouses work and run the family. Even in this case the woman overnight after marriage, has the legal rights of the property of the groom and his parental property. This case woman is expected to be in the house of the man.

Streedhan: Money belongs to a woman. Woman receives money, necklaces, gold, coins, etc etc during her lifetime be it from brothers, father, sister, husband, relatives, during marriage, after marriage, festivals etc. It is typically based on the services of the woman to others she keeps earning appropriately. A husband giving necklace to the wife, brother giving gold coins to the sister during festivals like rakhi, other festivals etc. Legal laws are stricktly enforced and made sure the woman’s streedhan is not lost from her (be it from groom side or from bride side) even during matrimonial issues. She can utilize streedhan to start her career and act as some sort of relief or investment to further her life. Her salary is also her streedhan.

聘礼:男方为了求娶媳妇而付给女方的钱,通常是给新娘父亲的。现在,女孩也得在外面工作,挣钱养家。这是典型的低种姓。通常能见到的体力劳动者,夫妻双方都在工作、供养家人。即使在这种情况下,女方婚后第二天,也会合法的拥有男方和男方父母的财产。这种情况下,女人应该呆在男人家里。

女性的体己钱:这些钱属于女性。女性在一生中,不管是结婚期间、结婚后,还是节日时,会从兄弟、父亲、姐妹、丈夫、亲戚等人处得到金钱、项链、黄金、钱币等。女性的收入通常是基于她对他人的服侍。在兄妹节这样的节日或其他节日时,丈夫会送项链给妻子,兄弟送金币给妹妹。法律得到严格执行,确保妇女的体己钱甚至在遇到在婚姻问题时,不会遭到损失(新郎一方和新娘一方都不得霸占)。她可以利用体己钱做点事业,作为某种寄托或投资,以维持她的生活。她的工资也属于她自己的体己钱。

Ghar Jamai: This is the case where groom will move from his parents house and live in bride’s house after marriage. All the above terminologies like dowry, bride price, streedhan can still be applied in this as well in some lighter form or stricter form. It is just that after marriage the groom will move into brides family and live with the brides family. This case the groom (irony still is called patriarchal) doesn’t have rights on the property of the bride’s parental property/grand parental property.

上门女婿:这指的是新郎婚后从父母家搬到新娘家的情况。以上的嫁妆、彩礼、女方体己钱等说法在这种情况下也适用,可多可少。只是婚后,新郎会搬到新娘的家里,和新娘一家住在一起。在这种情况下,新郎(很讽刺,还是重男轻女)对新娘父母/祖父母的财产没有主张的权利。

译文来源:三泰虎    http://www.santaihu.com/46879.html       译者:Joyceliu

Caring the aged: A male/son is suppose to feed/take care of the older parents (In other places it may be called as mama’s boy or immatured practice? or whatever). There are legal laws and social laws, male is considered good only if he takes care of aged parents. Bride is given to groom because he is loyal to parents, thinking he will be loyal to his wife. Of course, a woman as a wife/daughter in law taking care of aged parents is considered good. A woman as a daughter taking care of her father is considered bad symtom of her male sibling not taking care of the family. However, if a girl has no male sibling it is the duty bound of the husband to take care of the aged parents of the wife as well.

Each Indian family has its own set of practices/rituals. But they mostly revolve around the above practices/rituals. And the important thing is family systems ensure that girl/boy/aged/infant/teen/any other will not fall out from the family system and become alien or alienated. No need of any govt to support the old/alienated etc.

India is mostly hindu. Hindu don’t have divorce laws. They were introduced after 1947 probably just to align to the global world views.

照顾老人:男孩/儿子应该赡养/照顾年长的父母(在其他国家,这可能被说成妈宝男或不成熟或其他吧)。这世界上存在着法治法律和社会法律,男性只有照顾年迈的父母才会被世人认同。男性只有对父母忠诚,人们才会认为他会对妻子忠诚,才能娶上媳妇。当然了,女性作为妻子/媳妇照顾年迈的父母才能被世人称赞。一个女性,作为女儿照顾她自己的父亲,会被人议论她的兄弟不照顾家庭。但是,如果一个女孩没有兄弟,丈夫就有义务照顾妻子年迈的父母。

每个印度家庭都有自己的一套习俗。但大多都围绕着上述的习俗和礼仪。重要的是,家庭制度确保女孩/男孩/老人/婴儿/少年/任何其他人不会脱离家庭制度、变得陌生或疏远。任何政府都不需要抚养老年人/被疏远的人等。

印度主要信奉印度教。印度教没有离婚法条。1947年之后引入离婚发条可能只是为了迎合全球的世界观。

 

Manu Kanchan,

It is mostly because of the way Patriarchal system works in India.

In India women are mostly considered as a liability. As here like in other places “Men are suppose to be the bread winners and women as the home makers.” So women don’t earn or even if they earn, it is (suppose to be) less than their husband’s.

Also may be in places like “Zimbabwe, and Africa at large” the family/household work women do is being recognized by the groom (guessing from your description) but here that work is mostly remains unrecognized. Many a times I have heard men saying to women “You don’t do any work… keep quiet… don’t interfere in outside world things/decisions” So they are considered as liabilities…

Before the marriage this liability is taken care of, by girl’s father and then after marriage it is her husband’s job.

The dowry is suppose to help the husband in taking care of his wife. So, the dowry in one way contributes to Man’s income.

这主要是因为印度的父权制度。

在印度,女性通常被认为是一种负担。印度人就像其他地区的人一样认为“男人应该负责养家糊口,女人应该负责做家务。”所以女人不挣钱,或者即使她们挣钱,也(应该)比她们丈夫少。

可能在像“津巴布韦和非洲”这样的地方,女性承担家庭/家务工作,会被新郎认可(根据你的描述猜测的),但在印度,大部分女性的付出仍然不被认可。很多次我听到过男人对女人说“你什么都不用干……闭嘴……不要干涉外头的事情/决定”,所以她们被认为是一种负担……

婚前这种负担由女方的父亲承担,婚后则由男方承担。

嫁妆是用来帮助丈夫照顾妻子的。因此,嫁妆在某种程度上提高了男性的收入。

 

Lakshmi Ame, Working for the Government of India

Origin of dowry-

The family wealth was divided only among the sons and not the daughters. So the father of the bride would give a share of his property to his daughter WILLINGLY as a token of his love towards her at the time of her marriage. Here, the keywords being - "willingly" and "to the daughter" and not the son-in-law.

This share later acquired the name of "dowry system" though still prevalent it is abolished by law and has a certain stigma attached  -

- daughters have an equal right in ancestral property

- greed on the part of the in-laws leading to atrocities on women 

i wont be going  further into the legal/social aspects anymore as your question doesn't demand them.

hope it helped.

嫁妆的起源- - - - - -

家产只分给儿子,不分给女儿。所以新娘的父亲会很乐意在女儿结婚时,把他的一份财产分给女儿,作为父亲对女儿之爱的象征。这里的关键字是—“心甘情愿”和“赠给女儿”,而不是女婿。

这份财产后来得了“嫁妆制度”的名,虽然仍然盛行,但已被法律废除,并带上了一丝贬义

-女儿对祖先的财产享有平等权利

-姻亲的贪婪导致对妇女的暴行

我不想继续深入讨论法律/社会方面的问题了,因为你的问题并没有问这些。

希望我的回答对你有点用。

 

印度新娘

 

Vandana T, I stand by Indian laws of marriage

In old days , dowry was established as a practice when women didn't work and were supposed to only take care of household , raise children and please their husbands. Hence the bridegroom was given dowry so that he doesn't face sudden burden and is able to transition smoothly into his married life with monetry help.

Now since the bride paid dowry, to bring equilibrium in the women’s rights, the laws were made where women were given rights on husband’a income and property. Made sense then??

Now times have changed and women earn and have become more independent and can speak for their rights. Why has the dowry still survived and still is a passing criteria for most arranged marriages? When a guy is caught in a dowry demand case , he very shamelessly says that the dowry was given with consent and was not asked for! But has anyone ever asked him if he would have married the girl without her riches??

在旧社会,嫁妆是一种习俗,那时妇女不工作,只负责照顾家庭、养育孩子和取悦丈夫。因此,新郎得到了嫁妆,这样他就不会面临突如其来的负担,并能够用这笔钱让他婚姻生活初期得以顺利的过渡。

现在,既然新娘提供嫁妆,为了妇女平权制定了法律,赋予了妇女对丈夫的收入和财产的主张权利。嫁妆还有意义吗? ?

现在时代变了,妇女挣钱了,变得更独立了,可以为自己的权利说话了。为什么嫁妆仍然存在,并且仍然是大多数包办婚姻必须考量的标准?当一个男人被卷入嫁妆索要案时,他非常无耻地说嫁妆是双方都同意的,不是他开口索要的!但有没有人问问他,如果没有她的财富,他是否还会娶她?

Till today guys are being brought up as assets and investment ideas by parents and when time comes , they are cashed , sometimes many times.

In such a society, if a woman after paying hefty dowry to the groom, asks for her own rights, which are legal by the way, why is that it is treated unfair and the girl as a witch ?

直到今天,男孩们都是被父母当作资产和投资理念来培养的,时机成熟时,他们就会被套现,有时会被套现很多次。

在这样的社会里,如果一个女人向新郎提供了巨额嫁妆后,要求自己的权利,顺便说一下,这是合法的,为什么这会是不公平的,这个女人就是个女巫?

 

Nymfa Abalos

never been heard about girls giving dowry just to get married... it would not cost you much if you love the man that you  are paying for   and he loves you too, but what if you are not financially stable and belong to a lower middle or lower class family then you don't get a chance to get married....

If I am an Indian girl "your son is yours..and my money is mine"  especially when the money comes  from my parents pocket  I wouldn't allow my parents to strive hard to pay for someone or random guy to marry me because this guy is that..."like that"... "perfect" you will get a better future" ... Instead I will be the one to strive hard.. get a degree, be educated ,find a stable job and guys will find you there is no ugly woman  in the eyes of man if you are educate and successful (just for practicality) actually its just a bonus if you are successful  of course you must have the inner beauty ....

and for Indian guys be a man never let yourself to be dictate by your parents or  others  besides I don't know what kind of nerve you have if you let you this things happen ...jeez I don't know how handsome Indian men are to receive this kind of privileges.... thanks

从来没有听说过女孩子为了结婚而送嫁妆……如果你喜欢这个拿了你嫁妆的男人,他也爱你,这并不会花费你太多。但如果你收入不稳定,属于中等或较低阶级家庭,你就没有机会结婚....

如果我是印度女孩,我会说“你儿子是你的……我的钱是我的”,尤其是这钱是从我父母的口袋里掏出来的,我不会让我的父母为了让某个人或随便哪个家伙娶我而辛苦,不管这个男人有多“完美”“你会有一个更好的未来”……相反,我会自己努力奋斗。拿到学位,接受教育,找一份稳定的工作,男人自会发现你,如果你受过良好教育,事业成功,在男人眼里,是没有丑女人的,事实上,你若事业有成,只是个加分项,当然了,你必须有内在美....

对于印度男人来说,永远不要让自己受到父母或其他人的支配,而且我不知道如果你让这种事情发生,你得有多大的勇气多厚的脸皮……呀我不知道印度男人到底有多帅,能够得到这种特权....谢谢

 

Akshay Vannery, works at Blue Cross Blue Shield Association

In ancient times, people got married at a young age. Often before they started earning money. India being a relatively poor country, this meant an additional mouth to feed. Considering the patriarchal social system, the elders (males) of the house would eat first, followed by the children, and the women would eat last. You could substitute food with other things, but this was the standard pecking order.

So the girl's parents would give her money and wealth so she could manage on her own. But the patriarchy system ensured the money went to the groom's family and not directly to the bride. Something so normal was distorted into something evil and cruel as time passed, and grooms started demanding dowry. As a result, parents started giving their daughters her share of inheritance during the wedding itself.

Dowry is still prevalent in many parts of India. But it is slowly and steadily dying out as a custom. My Father married my mother 26 years ago, but he chose to take just 1 Rupee (nominal amount) as a token dowry, and turned down all the cash my poor grandfather had managed to save up.

在古代,人们很早就结婚了。通常在他们开始赚钱之前就结婚了。印度是一个相对贫穷的国家,这意味着结婚后要多养活一张嘴。在男权社会制度下,家里的长辈(男性)先吃饭,然后是孩子,最后是女人。其他东西也一样,但这是标准的顺序。

所以女孩的父母会给她一些钱和财产,让她能够自己管理。但是父权制度确保了钱都流入新郎的家庭,而不是直接留在新娘手中。随着时间的流逝,原本正常的东西被扭曲成了邪恶和残忍的东西,新郎们开始索要嫁妆。因此,在婚礼期间,父母们把属于女儿那份的遗产分给了女儿们。

嫁妆在印度的许多地方仍然很盛行。但作为一种习俗,它正在缓慢而稳定地消亡。我父亲26年前娶了我母亲,但他只拿了1卢比(名义上的)作为象征性的嫁妆,并拒绝了我可怜的外祖父攒下的所有现金。

 

Hemant Ku, Bored geek

It is primarily because of female greed

Dowry is primary because of equal GREED of both sides, Male as well as Female.

这主要是因为女性的贪婪

嫁妆之所以重要,是因为男女双方都一样贪心。

  • Male as he gets money,
  • Female as she gets a a guy above her calibre.
  • 男方,有钱拿
  • 女方,得以高嫁。

If male = female, in status and earning capacity, no one will ask for dowry. But girls want rich guy (who does by hard work, if not by family income) without her earning the same income by her own hard work.

If female marry only their own equivalent, like if she earns 10k a month and marry a 10 k month person, then both are equal and there is no need of dowry.

But if she earns 10k and expects her husband to earn 100k, then they are inequal, and there is dowry (additional money) for leveling to his standard.

Please do not say that income level of male is never considered when females are looking for marriage.

如果在地位和收入能力上男女平等,没有人会要求嫁妆。但是女孩想要嫁个有钱的男人(要么靠努力工作,要么靠家庭收入),而不是靠自己的努力工作获得同样的收入。

如果女性只是和自己差不多的男人结婚,比如她一个月挣1万美元,嫁一个每月也挣1万美元的人,那么这两人是平等的,不需要嫁妆。

但如果她挣1万美元,而希望她的丈夫能赚10万美元,那么他们是不平等的,就要有嫁妆(额外的钱)来达到他的标准。

请不要跟我说女性在找婆家时,从来没有考虑过男方的收入水平。

 

印度新娘

 

Krishna Yogi, works at Microsoft

Here’s the fundamental reason which no one could guess correctly.

In Zimbabwe and most parts of Africa , polygamy is still practiced , hence a rich man could marry more than one woman thus creating a natural demand for women, which means no women has to pay to get married.

However since british raj, India has declared polygamy illegal ( which is very unethical , law shouldn't interfere in personal matters to be honest ) the demand for women decreased drastically and eventually, the practice of bride price ceased to exst.

我来说说根本原因,还没有人准确地猜到。

在津巴布韦和非洲大部分地区,一夫多妻制仍然存在,因此一个富人可以娶多个女人,从而产生了对女人的自然需求,这意味着女人不需要花钱就能嫁人。

然而,自从英国统治印度以来,印度宣布一夫多妻制是非法的(这是非常不道德的,法律不应该干涉个人事务),婚嫁市场对女性的需求急剧下降,最终,彩礼的做法不复存在。

This logic is established by the fact that dowry is not well practiced in Indian Muslims where polygamy is still prevalent per se. Is the system of taking dowry prevalent among Indian Muslims?

Bride price is the most long standing tradition in human history compared the recent dowry as polygamy was practiced all along.

Just to be clear, India did have bride price custom just 200 years before and it was the boy child who were killed at infant age ( compared to female infanticide today, speak of turning tide ) as boys wouldn't bring any money etc ( one of my great great grandfather was apparently saved by relative from getting killed )

这种逻辑是基于印度msl中就很少有嫁妆一说,他们的一夫多妻制仍然很普遍。印度msl中盛行嫁妆制度吗?

与近代的嫁妆相比,彩礼是人类历史上最悠久的传统,因为一夫多妻制一直存在。

要清楚一点,印度在200年前就有聘礼的习俗了,所以男孩在婴儿时期就会被杀(跟今日溺杀女婴相对应),男孩带不来任何钱(我的一个曾曾曾祖父就在被杀时被亲戚救了下来)

 

Sanmoy Chakraborty, Indian, Bengali, Hindu. Avid reader, traveller, Interested in history

The dowry is paid typically by the bride’s parents. The logic is, that the bride would move in with the guy and he would be responsible for her well being and maintenance.

Secondly, the girl child did not get any property after her father’s death. The dowry was kind of a severance package paid to the groom and his family if you will.

The practice is a social evil. It’s a blatant violation of women’s rights, highlights the duplicitous nature of a male dominated society and is against any logical inheritance law.

Sadly, in many parts of India the dowry system still dominates decisions of marriage. It’s more of a socio-cultural issue that won’t get fixed till the general mindset of people ESPECIALLY WOMEN’s change.

嫁妆通常由新娘的父母支付。逻辑是,新娘会搬去和男方住,男方会负责她的幸福和生活。

其次,女孩在父亲死后不会得到任何财产。嫁妆是付给新郎和他家人的遣散费。

这种做法是一种社会弊病。这是对妇女权利的公然侵犯,突出了男性主导社会的两面三刀的性质,违反了合理的继承法。

可悲的是,在印度的许多地方,嫁妆制度仍然主导着婚姻的决策。这更多的是个社会文化问题,只有当人们的普遍心态,尤其是女性的心态发生改变时,这个问题才能得以解决。

 

Anonymous

Because we want to buy the grooms for the price tag their families put across their faces. (Sarcasm. But this is what I take it as. Also, this is technically correct from a transaction point of view).

因为我们想以新郎家人在他们脸上贴的价格标签来买下他们。(我说的是反话。但我就是这样认为的。而且,从交易的角度来看,这在技术上是正确的)。

 

Mrityunjay Singh

Wife  has right in both her own father/mother and father/mother in law  property. Similarly husband has right to take property of his own  father/mother and father/mother in law. That is why dowry(amount must equal to girls property to his father side) is justifiable  thing for marriage.  If girls father/mother has no property then he has  to search husband such that husband family has no property. This makes  equal status and both guy equal expectation level. Girl child killing  does not happen because of dowry. It happens because of greed of money.

妻子对自己的父亲/母亲和公公/婆婆的财产都有所有权。同样,丈夫也有权取得自己的父亲/母亲和岳父/岳母的财产。这就是为什么嫁妆是结婚的必备品。如果女孩的父亲/母亲没有财产,那么他必须找一个没有财产的夫家。夫妻条件平等,期望值匹配。女童被杀并不是因为嫁妆。这种事的产生是因为对金钱的贪婪。

外文链接:https://www.quora.com/Why-do-Indian-brides-have-to-pay-dowry-to-prospective-husbands

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