Why were the merchants not respected in ancient China?
为什么在古代中国商人不受尊重?
以下是Quora读者的评论:
Thai Nguyen Gia
With so many answers already, I would just use a different tack: Economics.
Merchants represent the ability to bring products from one area (export) to another (import). Speaking from pure economics view, that meant Free Trade versus Protectionism which is the main voice of their opposition. When they want to suppress Merchants, it mostly mean the local factions suppress the outsiders encroaching on their (provincial) markets.
既然已经有这么多答案了,我打算换个角度:从经济学方面来谈。
商人具备将产品从一个地区(出口)运往另一地区(进口)的能力。从纯粹的经济学角度来讲,这意味着自由贸易与保护主义的对立,而保护主义正是反对商人的主要观点。当有人想要打压商人时,大多意味着当地势力在抵制外来者对地方市场的侵入。
Why is that so loud, so official in China compare to Western? Because of size. China compose of so many areas it’s comparable to full Europe continent. If you think of Suppress Merchants dialog in the same way of Free Trade Between European Nations you would see right away the logic behind. And if you push the timeline back to Medieval Era, you will see why this dialog is so strong in China, and almost none exsting in Europe: “Free Trade? What Free Trade? What nonsense are you talking about?”
The logic behind the protest of merchants that can trade between coastal China to inland province is the same as logic behind protest of Free Trade between Netherland and, say, Switzerland. Or in term of product, imported sea salts will kill mountainous rock salt, so to protect later they need to prevent importing former, which mean suppress the merchants that sell former.
为何在中国,这种打压商人的声音相比西方,显得更为强烈且堂而皇之呢?这是规模所致。中国地域广阔,诸多地区加起来堪比整个欧洲大陆。要是你把打压商人的言论,等同于欧洲国家间关于自由贸易的争议,立马就能明白背后的逻辑。要是把时间线往前推到中世纪,你就会明白为何这种言论在中国如此强烈,而在欧洲却几乎不存在:“自由贸易?什么自由贸易?你在胡说些什么?”
那些从事中国沿海与内陆省份间贸易的商人所提出抗议的背后逻辑,和荷兰与比如说瑞士之间关于自由贸易抗议的逻辑是一样的。或者从产品角度来说,进口海盐会冲击山区岩盐,所以为了保护岩盐,就需要阻止海盐的进口,这就意味着要打压销售海盐的商人。
John Connor
Confucianism taught that merchants would tend towards committing greed, a corrupt influence upon the moral society.
儒家思想认为,商人往往会变得贪婪,这会对道德社会产生腐蚀作用。
Johnny
The interest class formed by the collusion between officials and merchants will become an intermediate class that hinders the relationship between the emperor and the people, which can not only empty imperial power but also squeeze the people.
官商勾结形成的利益阶层,会成为阻碍皇帝与民众关系的中间阶层,这不仅会架空皇权,还会压榨百姓。
Aozao Zhou
The rulers of ancient China believed that merchants pursued interests, so they were essentially people with bad morals. In addition, the ancient Chinese believed that the merchants only moved the goods from a to B, which did not create value and did not conform to the Chinese value of creating value through labor. Therefore, the behavior of the merchants was not worth advocating. Therefore, merchants in ancient China had been strictly restricted. In some periods, merchants had to wear clothes of specific colors and materials to show their differences from other people. And in some periods, the children of businessmen were not allowed to apply for the civil service.
中国古代的统治者认为,商人追逐利益,本质上是道德败坏之人。此外,古代中国人觉得商人仅仅是将货物从一地运往另一地,并未创造价值,不符合中国人通过劳动创造价值的观念。因此,商人的行为不值得提倡。故而,中国古代的商人一直受到严格限制。在某些时期,商人必须穿着特定颜色和材质的衣服,以显示他们与其他人的区别。还有些时期,商人的子女不被允许参加科举入仕。
But these are appearances. The real reason is that famine has been a serious threat to the whole history of China, and the rulers of ancient China thought that the best way to solve the famine was to let enough people cultivate the land. Therefore, in ancient China, the management of farmers was very strict. They hoped that farmers would always be farmers and always work in peace of mind. Therefore, in ancient China, the ranking of occupations was "Shi \ Nong \ Gong \ Shang", which means that civil servants are the first, farmers are the second, skilled workers are the third, and businessmen are the last. This kind of thinking has been influencing China to the present.
但这些只是表象。真正的原因是,饥荒在中国历史上一直是严重威胁,而古代中国的统治者认为解决饥荒的最佳办法,是让足够多的人从事农业生产。所以,在古代中国,对农民的管理十分严格。统治者希望农民能一直安心务农。因此,在古代中国,职业排序为“士、农、工、商”,即官员排第一,农民排第二,手工业者排第三,商人则排在最后。这种观念一直影响中国至今。
This kind of thinking also directly led China to pursue a closed door policy in the era of Western navigation. Because if everyone went to sea trade and even became pirates, the number of farmers would be reduced. Therefore, the chinese at that time relocated the fishermen from the coastal areas to the mainland and did not allow any ships to go into the sea.
So, in the final analysis, this is the need of ancient Chinese rulers to continue their rule.
这种观念还直接导致中国在西方大航海时代奉行闭关锁国政策。因为倘若人人都去从事海上贸易甚至当上海盗,农民的数量就会减少。所以,当时的中国将沿海渔民迁至内陆,并且禁止任何船只出海。
所以,归根结底,这是古代中国维持统治的需要。
Yuan Li
Who doesn't like money? Farmers needed money to buy cattle, and emperors needed money to pay military salaries. There were many economic wars during the Spring and Autumn Period and the Warring States Period. General businessmen bribe government officials during the Great Unification period, (sorry, political donations). There will also be distant relatives of high-ranking officials doing business, in order to lay the foundation for their own monopoly. All in all, it's a stereotype. There will be many restrictions on merchants, but everyone knows that merchants have the ability to break through the restrictions. So it is in the middle of the dynamic, probably understand it this way.
谁不喜欢钱呢?农民需要钱来买耕牛,皇帝需要钱来发军饷。春秋战国时期就有很多经济战。大一统时期,一般商人会贿赂政府官员(抱歉,是政治献金)。也会有高官的远亲经商,以便为自己的垄断打下基础。总而言之,这就是一种刻板印象。对商人会有诸多限制,但大家都知道商人有突破这些限制的能力。所以,情况处于一种动态变化之中,大概可以这样理解。
Mark Francis
They were distrusted, since their values were monetary.
The state kept them under strict control, at least it did the larger elements; as the PRC does now.
Confucianism disdains money-makers.
他们商人不被信任,因为他们秉持金钱至上的价值观。
国家对他们进行严格管控,至少对那些规模较大的商人是如此;就如同现在的中华人民共和国一样。
儒家思想鄙视逐利之人。
Thomas Lew
emperors are more interested in feeding the population..china has a problem feeding their population in the pass ..even today china has to import huge amount of food…agri; -farmers are hard work to encourage people to work on the farm is 1st priority…as a matter of fact merchants are frown on
皇帝们更关心百姓的温饱问题。中国过去在保障民众粮食供应方面存在困难,即便在今天,中国仍需大量进口粮食。农业方面,农民劳作艰辛,鼓励人们从事农业生产是首要任务。事实上,商人是不受待见的。
Vladimir Wieyanto
Because the ancient “Chinese” value thing such as honestly and integrity far more so than profit.
The ancient “Chinese” despised the merchants for the same reason modern people despised car salesmen/women.
They will say ANYTHING to get you buy their products, using mixture of truths and lies and rumours as long as they make the sales.
And then, when the products were found to be defective, they will point to very small ambiguous prints of the sales contracts, to get themsleves out of any obligations, leaving you in the “he said she said no mans’ land”, with no money and broken products.
因为古代“中国人”极为看重诚实、正直等品质,远甚于利益。
古代“中国人”鄙视商人,就如同现代人鄙视汽车销售员一样。
为了让你购买他们的产品,这些销售员会无所不用其极,真假参半、谣言四起,只求促成交易。
然后,当产品被发现有缺陷时,他们就会指着销售合同里模糊不清的小字眼,推卸所有责任,让你陷入“公说公有理,婆说婆有理”的困境,钱货两空。
Garvin Hon Zhao
There are many explanations for this:
1: Merchants(商人) literally mean people from the Shang 商 Dynasty. The origin of merchants was a group of officials of the Shang Dynasty who did not become slaves after the failure of the Shang. People despised merchants, but they actually despised losers.
2: Merchants did not produce things in ancient times (and still do nowadays), and in an age where actual production was valued, this behavior was disapproved. Note: If farmers/artisans sell some agricultural or handcrafted products, they are still considered farmers/artisans. At the same time, merchants are disgusting to others because they value their interests rather than hel each other.
对于这一现象有诸多解释:
1. “商人”一词从字面意义来讲,指的是商朝之人。商人的起源是商朝灭亡后未沦为奴隶的一群商朝官员。人们鄙视商人,实则是鄙视失败者。
2. 在古代(甚至如今也是),商人并不从事生产。在一个重视实际生产的时代,这种行为不被认可。需注意:如果农民或工匠售卖一些农产品或手工艺品,他们仍被视为农民或工匠。同时,商人令他人厌恶,因为他们只看重自身利益,而非互助。
3: For the ruler, the merchant breaks the ruler's monopoly on commodities. Here is another definition. If it is a government-run store, the people working in it are government employees, not businessmen. Therefore, ruling Those who wish to monopolize the market for commodities, such as salt, wine, tea, and even food.
4:Moving on to the previous point, food (grain), once the ancient chinese solves this problem, then it will be stable. (So, one of the reasons for the collapse of many dynasties is the sudden drop in food production), merchants buy surplus grain from farmers. It is in a certain extent that they have the ability to control the country's economy. People fear that they will deliberately destroy the country's economy.
5:The last point: these businessmen who only care about their own interests, don't care about farmers, don't care about the country. This point has been demonstrated in China from the middle of the Ming Dynasty to the end of the Republic of China and even until now.
(this question is a worthy discuss topic, many historians are still writing essays about it)
3. 对于统治者而言,商人打破了统治者对商品的垄断。这里还有另一种界定。如果是国营商店,在其中工作的人是政府雇员,而非商人。因此,统治者希望垄断诸如盐、酒、茶乃至粮食等商品的市场。
4. 接着上一点来说,粮食,一旦中国古代政府解决了粮食问题,国家就会趋于稳定。(所以,许多朝代覆灭的原因之一就是粮食产量的骤降)。商人从农民手中收购余粮,在一定程度上,他们具备影响国家经济的能力。人们担心他们会蓄意破坏国家经济。
5. 最后一点:这些只在乎自身利益的商人,既不关心农民,也不关心国家。从明朝中期到中华民国末年,甚至直至今日,这一点在中国都有所体现。
(这个问题是一个值得探讨的话题,许多历史学家仍在撰写相关论文。)
Andrew McGreevy
Confucian scholars did not value merchants because merchants wanted profits and profit making was not ethical according to the scholars. In explaining this, Confucius was quoted as writing, “ The mind of the superior man is conversant with righteousness; the mind of the mean man is conversant with profit.” (p. 207. The Age of Confucian Rule: The Song Transformation of China by D. Kuhn).
Thus, we find discussion of the concept of “four occupations” in Chinese social history: scholar/gentry, peasant, artisan, and merchant. (P. 147, The Troubled Empire: China in the Yuan and Ming Dynasties, by T. Brook)
While merchants were not respected by Confucians, emperors enjoyed tax revenue from trade and many Confucian officials became wealthy people through government service…
儒家学者不看重商人,因为在这些学者看来,商人追逐利润,而逐利不符合道德规范。为解释这一点,有人引用孔子的话:“君子喻于义,小人喻于利。”(出自D. 库恩所著《儒家统治的时代:宋的转型》第207页)。
因此,我们在中国社会历史中能看到“四民”概念的相关论述:士(士绅)、农、工、商。(出自卜正民所著《纵乐的困惑:晚明史》第147页)。
尽管商人不受儒家学者尊重,但皇帝从贸易中获得税收,而且许多儒家官员通过为官也变得富有……
Ralph Zhang
Good question. If you look back the history, merchants were very strong and greatly respect in chunqiu & zhanguo periods, which is before 220 BC.
At that moment, weapons are controlled by merchants, horses are controlled by merchants and food are controlled by merchants. Some merchants even killed the kings and take their place to be the King of some Kingdom. For example Qi, is richest kingdom in China at that moment. It’s King was replaced by merchant. Qin shihuang, the first emperor of China, got lots of support from Lv buwei, the biggest merchant in Qin to succeed conquer China.
Now you can see, the reason ancient Chinese emperors kee on oppressing merchants is because they knew how powerful the merchants could be.
问得好。回顾历史,在公元前220年之前的春秋战国时期,商人势力强大且备受尊崇。
当时,武器、马匹和粮食都由商人掌控。有些商人甚至弑君篡位,自己成为某个诸侯国的国君。例如,齐国在当时是中国最富有的诸侯国,其国君就被商人取代。中国的第一位皇帝秦始皇,在统一中国的过程中,得到了秦国最大的商人吕不韦的大力支持。
由此可见,中国古代皇帝之所以一直打压商人,是因为他们深知商人的力量可以多么强大。
Miles Negrete
That implies they were respected elsewhere in the world at the time.
That was far from the case.
You might remember a culture famous for being traders. Modern scholarship calls them “Phoenicians”. But in the old days, they were called “Philistines” by the Israelites. They weren’t very popular. Though in the Israelites (and the Romans, some time later during the Carthaginian Affairs) defense, it might have something to do with all of the human sacrifice they did.
这意味着当时商人在世界其他地方也受到尊重。
事实远非如此。
你可能记得有一个以贸易闻名的文化群体。现代学术上称他们为“腓尼基人”。但在过去,以色列人称之为“非利士人”。他们可不怎么受欢迎。不过,为以色列人(以及后来在迦太基事务时期的罗马人)说句公道话,这可能和腓尼基人进行活人献祭的行为有关。
Anyway, apart from when merchants became the government like in Italy, merchants weren’t very well thought of anywhere. Near the end of the shogunate period, many samurai complained that merchants were treated better than they were due to their money, despite being legally inferior to them.
It wasn’t until Adam Smith came along and offered an explanation as to why and how merchants got their money that didn’t involve the usual accusations of malfeasance that merchants stopped getting a bad rap.
But it wasn’t just ancient China. It was everywhere.
总之,除了在意大利等地商人成为统治阶层的情况外,商人在其他任何地方都不太受待见。在幕府时代末期,许多日本武士抱怨说,尽管从法律地位上讲商人低于他们,但因为有钱,商人的待遇比他们还好。
直到亚当·斯密出现,并给出了一种关于商人如何以及为何获得财富的解释,且这种解释不涉及以往对商人不正当行为的指责,商人才不再背负恶名。
但并非只有古代中国如此,世界各地皆是这般。
Kevin Anderson
Merchants merely moved stuff from A to B, and then sometimes to C or D.
They didn’t actually produce anything.
They were the links in the chain between production and consumption.
All hail farmers, peasants, goat herders etc. who actually produced something!
商人只不过是把货物从甲地运到乙地,有时还会转运到丙地或丁地。
他们实际上并不生产任何东西。
他们只是生产与消费链条中的连接环节。
向真正从事生产的农民、农夫、牧羊人等致敬!
Ruby Tsao
Shang Dynasty was defeated by Zhou Dynasty about 3000 years ago. Shang people became slaves. Without ownership of land, they made a living by trading which sometimes involved cheating. They did not engage in production, good deeds or made positive contribution to society, only interested in profit. It was not considered a noble profession. Merchants were called “Shang ren” ever since. In later dynasties, merchants developed Confucian ethics of honesty, trust, fair trade and charity. They received respect in society.
大约3000年前,商朝被周朝打败。商朝遗民沦为奴隶,没有土地所有权,只能靠贸易为生,而这一过程中有时还会涉及欺诈行为。他们不从事生产,也不做善事,没有对社会做出积极贡献,只一心逐利。因此,经商不被视为高尚的职业。从那时起,从事商业活动的人就被称为“商人”。在后来的朝代里,商人们发展出了诚信、守诺、公平交易和乐善好施的儒家商业道德规范,从而在社会上赢得了尊重。
Michael Ciao
Merchants were always the richest people in every village, town and country, they were well respected by all in ancient China.
History is written by scholars and bureaucrats, they were not wealthy, so there were jealous, that is human nature, even today, as such, they put down the wealthy merchants in the histories they wrote.
Poor people always envy the rich, anywhere in the world. When there is no escape from poverty, hating the rich is their only escape from reality.
在古代中国,商人一直是每个乡村、城镇和国家中最富有的人,他们受到所有人的敬重。
历史是由学者和官员书写的,他们并不富有,所以心怀嫉妒,这是人之常情,即便在今天也是如此。因此,他们在自己所撰写的历史中贬低富有的商人。
穷人总是嫉妒富人,在世界任何地方都一样。当无法摆脱贫困时,仇富就是他们逃避现实的唯一途径。
Peter Pappas
Many societies did not respect merchants. Remember merchants amassed a lot of wealth (often more than even the nobility). However merchants were commoners and so the nobles looked down on them. Merchants had to work for their money (unlike the nobles who inherited their wealth) so Nobles viewed them as scheming and manipulative and cut throat to amass such large fortunes without a family name and being of low birth. It was out of partial jealousy and partial fear that merchants would overtake the noble ruling class who were often in debt and while owning lots of land and power in government tended to have limited liquid funds compared to the merchants who could usually out bid nobles on many purchases. It was a conflict of new money vs old money. Eventually nobles realized they needed the merchants and many nobles would marry daughters of wealthy merchants. This allowed the merchants heirs to get a title of nobility and the noble families to get an influx of funds through dowries and property agreements.
许多社会并不尊重商人。要知道,商人们积累了大量财富(往往比贵族还富有)。然而,商人只是平民,所以贵族们看不起他们。商人必须靠打拼赚钱(不像贵族靠继承财富),因此贵族们觉得他们工于心计、善于操控,而且出身低微又没有家族名望,却为了聚敛巨额财富不择手段。
部分出于嫉妒,部分出于担忧,贵族们害怕商人会超越他们这些统治阶层。贵族们常常负债累累,尽管拥有大量土地和政治权力,但与商人相比,他们的流动资金往往有限,在很多交易中,商人出价常常高于贵族。
这是新富与旧贵之间的矛盾。最终,贵族们意识到他们需要商人,许多贵族会迎娶富商的女儿。这样一来,商人的后代就能获得贵族头衔,而贵族家族则通过嫁妆和财产协议获得资金注入。
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